v-12's

Did anyone but Allison make a V-12 back in the 30's? I was at a sale yesterday for my MM swather and a junkyard owner came up to me and said he had a Twin City that someone had put a V-12 back during the depression (which makes me believe it is a TC 27-44 which is rare in the first place but anyways)... He wants to sell it so I plan on making a run back up that direction...

I think there were a few different ones. Liberty, Curtiss, LaFrance, Lincoln? I'm not sure...but grab it...it should be interesting if nothing else!

Lincoln Zephyrs had flathead V12's. Cadillac also used some V12's as did Marmon and Packard. American LaFrance had 2 series of V12's. The "big" one was all their own but the smaller one was based on a car engine. I'm thinking Packard but I could be wrong. Seagrave fire trucks also had 2 series of V12's. Again the big one was built in house but the smaller one was a modified Pierce-Arrow engine. On the Seagrave, Pierce-Arrow units the major difference was the Seagrave version used insert type rod bearings verus the Pierce-Arrow's poured babbit bearings. The Seagrave oil pumps were heavier also.

The main one I forgot....... Hall-Scot!!

the mention of seagrave made me look this up

photo gallery

http://www.seagrave.com/index.cfm?display=photo_gallery&galleryID=7&title=Antiques


in the early 90's i was part of an appraisal team that went to clintonville, WI--it was a cool place--lots of aluminum and stainless fab work--also hit one of the hole in the wall indian casinos--won 62.00 off a roll of nickels

Ya'll forgot the best one, the Merlin. Rolls Royce engine and some build by Packard I think. The engine powered P-51 (C and up) Mustangs. Most P-38s and many other WW2 planes.

GMC had a v-12 in their trucks as well.

Yeah, that was like 2 V6 engines crammed together. I think it was all one block but used 2 V6 top ends.

P38 still used Allisons. But yeah, the Merlin was the pinnical of V12's! I'll have to go look at what the dates are for production.
Didn't they call the GMC a "Toroflow"? I've never seen one, but hear that there's a few still floating around on displays.

since i do not have a file for that in my on board computational device(brain-what's left of it)--i did a search--wow--a bunch of v12 mfgs


http://wikicars.org/en/V12

hardtailjohn wrote:P38 still used Allisons. But yeah, the Merlin was the pinnical of V12's! I'll have to go look at what the dates are for production.
Didn't they call the GMC a "Toroflow"? I've never seen one, but hear that there's a few still floating around on displays.

oops, double post

hardtailjohn wrote:P38 still used Allisons. But yeah, the Merlin was the pinnical of V12's! I'll have to go look at what the dates are for production.
Didn't they call the GMC a "Toroflow"? I've never seen one, but hear that there's a few still floating around on displays.

Toro flow was a diesel GMC had in the 60s. IDK if they had it in a V12, the only one I remember seeing was a V8 I think. That was the 70s and kinda taxing my rememberin.
I was thinking the P38 got Merlins later on. I know the B model P51s had Allisons and couldn't get past about 30,000 feet, so the story goes. The superchargers on the Merlins allowed them to get to 50,000. I do know the Mosquito had twin Merlins, all plywood plane too. Some tanks had a version of the Allison. I think that's what Leno's Blastolene has in it.
OK, I just read up on the P38. They did have the 1710 Allison but with turbo chargers.

GMC only built their V12's for a couple of years. I'm thinkin 65-66 but not 100% sure. Yes they were a pair of V6's bolted together. Only ever saw one of them. A guy who lived about 10 miles from my folks had one in a Crackerbox. He must have had straight pipes on it cause it made more noise than a fookin Detroit.

Ahhhhhh.......that's right, the Toro was the diesel. Thanks. I remember an article in Wheels of Time about a guy putting v12 Lincolns in Ford dumptrucks in the 40's. Guess they were quite the hotrod back then!

There is a site for everything these days. Not for the short of cash but you can buy a hotrod V12 Jimmy.

http://thunderv12.com/

A good article on the Rolls Royce Merlin V12's.

http://www.aviation-history.com/engines/merlin.htm

An article I read years ago dubbed them as the engine that won the battle of Britain

Well someone had pictures of the beast....quite interesting:

http://www.ytmag.com/cgi-bin/viewit.cgi?bd=ttalk&th=911294

My father worked at LTV in GrandPraire before, during and after WWII
When the war started
He ran down to the recruiters and signed up because he flew P51's
They told him to have his bag packed and ready to go the next morning
He showed up earily and they told him to get his ass back to work
They had plenty of pilots but needed engineers like him in the plant more than pilots
When the Allison to RR engine swap came about he designed the new moter mounts and
most of the dash he said
He could test fly one anytime he wanted and would call his sister in Winnsboro Tx. and ask her what was for lunch
He said it was only 120 miles east and would land on the dirt road in front of her house.
Eat lunch and head back at work. Just another day at the office
He bought a P51 after the war. He said they were nearly giving them away then
He kept it a few years and sold it for a big profit he said

AlleyCat wrote:A good article on the Rolls Royce Merlin V12's.

http://www.aviation-history.com/engines/merlin.htm

An article I read years ago dubbed them as the engine that won the battle of Britain

Good read. The RR engine continued to be developed and by the end of WW2 they had it up around 1700 hp. That was in the H and J models that never saw WW2 combat though. There was also some cool experimental P51s with twin fuselages.
Apparently the old Twin Cities has a Seagrave fire truck engine. Too bad it's such a mess, those 2 pistons look like they got fragged pretty bad.

If I got this now I'm not sure if I would leave it with a v-12 or put it back original. It is one of TC's big twin cam's and they only made a handful over 800 between 1920-1926. I sure do wish you could buy new knobbies like those though!

CJ--cool story--it would be a blast to commute in a hotrod airplane--in ks one of the guys that graduated ahead of me became an air force pilot--viet nam era--about once a month he would buzz oberlin in his fighter--he never stopped for lunch though

Either way Lance, you GOTTA get that thing!!!

hardtailjohn wrote:Either way Lance, you GOTTA get that thing!!!

I have my dad pretty interested in it. A running original 20-35 will sit you back 10k!